Ford recently announced that their EVs will start using the Tesla charging system (recently made open and renamed the North American Charging Standard) in 2025. With Ford changing to the Tesla plug, do you think other North American manufacturers should follow suit? I've charged with both NACS and CCS and, in my opinion, Tesla is winning in this arena. The plug has a much smaller form factor and is more durable (what Scout owner doesn't want durability?). It's also a much simpler user experience and is proving more reliable than CCS networks so far. I know VW owns both Scout and Electrify America, which is a CCS network, but NACS just seems like the better system. I feel like Scout owners will be happier in the long run. There will be some pain on the manufacturers' and networks' end but I feel like the EV-going American will be happier in the end and more loyal to the brands that prioritize the owner experience. What do you all think? Ford Just Made a Brilliant, Blindingly Obvious Move by Embracing Tesla Charging (motortrend.com)
Should Scout adopt the NACS (Tesla) charging system
- Thread starter JohnBills
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I personally think the world will watch with interest to see what happens over the next couple of years.
For instance, will the Ford products have both the CCS and the NACS plugs or just the NACS plugs. Some clarity is needed from Ford.
For instance, will the Ford products have both the CCS and the NACS plugs or just the NACS plugs. Some clarity is needed from Ford.
I agree with @Jamie@ScoutMotors it is still unclear if Ford will be a) changing to only have the Tesla plug on their vehicle b) will have two plugs on their vehicle or c) will include an adpater and have the computers able to communicate with the tesla system.
Personally my money is on option C because Ford already have a working relationship with Electrify america which doesn't have any plans of including a Tesla plug on their systems.
Another thing to consider is that Tesla has already stated rolling out dual super chargers that have a CCS1 adapter connected to the system and can charge non tesla EVs. With this information i would say it is most likely that Ford will enable their vehicle to directly communicate with the super charger system to plug and charge.
but who knows, we shall see.
Edit: I wanted to add my personal opion on the matter. If the scout was built today and we had to make a decision of what charger to put on it the tesla plug would be the clear winner (given access to the SC network). However I belive that by 2026 not only will there be more options for electrify america or other chargers but i am going to assume that tesla will continue to roll out more super chargers that have CCS adapters on their systems.
I have seen the discussion of how the tesla charger is much "smaller" and that is true but it really isn't that much bigger, and i would be curious where the reference to it being more "durable" came from.
Personally my money is on option C because Ford already have a working relationship with Electrify america which doesn't have any plans of including a Tesla plug on their systems.
Another thing to consider is that Tesla has already stated rolling out dual super chargers that have a CCS1 adapter connected to the system and can charge non tesla EVs. With this information i would say it is most likely that Ford will enable their vehicle to directly communicate with the super charger system to plug and charge.
but who knows, we shall see.
Edit: I wanted to add my personal opion on the matter. If the scout was built today and we had to make a decision of what charger to put on it the tesla plug would be the clear winner (given access to the SC network). However I belive that by 2026 not only will there be more options for electrify america or other chargers but i am going to assume that tesla will continue to roll out more super chargers that have CCS adapters on their systems.
I have seen the discussion of how the tesla charger is much "smaller" and that is true but it really isn't that much bigger, and i would be curious where the reference to it being more "durable" came from.
I own a Polestar and use Electrify America, so I support the “CCS” approach. IMHO, Ford started out in EVs as a leader, but hasn’t been able to deliver. Ford is becoming a follower…that doesn’t seem like the “Scout mentality.”
I like the different inputs here. And I agree that Ford needs to clarify their plan. It will definitely be interesting to see how it shakes out. I've been in media for a long time and have seen several standards wars come and go. I remember when Blu-ray Discs vs HD-DVD was a hot topic. RIP HD-DVD.
Good question. This is a reference to what Ford CEO Jim Farley has said: "Charging plugs break. Tesla's plug is excellent, by the way, doesn't break if you drop it."
Despite the many faults with Tesla, the charging network has proven to be reliable. Scout should strongly consider if investing [more] in networks with reliability concerns makes better sense for the brand. Having one common network makes accessibility to charge stations and the potential for long travel westward feasible.
Side note, if Ford decides to provide an adapter then that will be an easy solution for them to implement.
Side note, if Ford decides to provide an adapter then that will be an easy solution for them to implement.
Here is the article with the anser but below is the TLDR:
ford will provide an adapter for the next few years while they are still producing the CCS socket, This adapter will allow ford vehicles to communicate with the Super charger network to gain access. Ford will be making all vehicles in the future with the tesla plug so no longer needing the adapter.
EDIT: With this precedence now being set i would really like it if Scout could negotiate access to super chargers via an adapter. I am still not convinced that switching to the tesla plug is the best move at the moment but if there is access to the super charger network though an adapter that would open up so much and allow the scout to be charged anywhere!...either that or switch to the tesla plug with an included CCS adapter....
either way this brings up a further discussion about regulation. in the EU the government mandated that all EVs will use the CCS2 plug and tesla made it so. the problem that the US is now facing is Tesla VS CCS...this is only going to fracture the infrastructure further and the longer we have two standards the harder it will be to combine them in the future. the north american market really needs to have one charging standard whether it is tesla or CCS...honestly it doesn't matter but the bigger issue is fracturing this and making EV owners have to carry extra adapters to accomidate the different companies instead of companies getting on the same page.
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Because it’s going to be BEV only, I want Scout to have access to the most convenient/accessible/reliable charging network. I’m pretty sure that is Tesla’s supercharger network. It’s been around for a decade and I see them everywhere when I’m on road trips which means they’re located at places I want to be. I hope Scout follows Ford’s lead and works with Tesla for compatibility.
I agree on the fracturing concerns. This is one time when I think our government and energy companies need to set a standard. I do hate thinking I’m going to pay more if using Tesla’s plug and paying licensing to them or perhaps they make it up off the actual chargers.
I’d still love to see Scout Motors develop small sales/charging “scout posts” experiences no matter which charging plug option they determine.
If you want to reinvent the original SUV and build electric networking why not also explore being the first dedicated service provider that reinvents the gas station/fuel stop. An “adventure” charging stop that relaxes, entertains kids and supplies food/drink vending while charging your Scout, or other EV. The Japanese have all kinds of food vending machines that heat/cook to order. There are even vending machines that will bake fresh bread. This experience with Scout branding would definitely convert EV drivers to the Scout way of life.
I’d still love to see Scout Motors develop small sales/charging “scout posts” experiences no matter which charging plug option they determine.
If you want to reinvent the original SUV and build electric networking why not also explore being the first dedicated service provider that reinvents the gas station/fuel stop. An “adventure” charging stop that relaxes, entertains kids and supplies food/drink vending while charging your Scout, or other EV. The Japanese have all kinds of food vending machines that heat/cook to order. There are even vending machines that will bake fresh bread. This experience with Scout branding would definitely convert EV drivers to the Scout way of life.
While 90% of charging will be at home for me, I like the Tesla standard, particularly if the truck can accept a rapid charge. Of course, we'd want the option to have other adapters that let us use a level 2 charger if that's the closest thing we can find on a trip, but I'd road trip using Tesla superchargers if the Scout could accept it and it's higher charge rates easily.
It's more than just a form-factor debate. CCS is an actual industry standard and has passed several hurdles to become one. CCS also supports bi-directional charging (like vehicle to grid for example) - something the Tesla connector does not. I refuse the call the Tesla connector NACS because it's a proprietary connector used by four cars. Tesla wants us all to call it NACS to make it seem like a foregone conclusion but it's not. Every non-Tesla EV on sale supports CCS (except the Leaf).
Being able to take power from a vehicle is a very important feature that should not be overlooked. CCS supports that today, Tesla connector does not. Sure maybe in the future the Tesla design could support it but currently CCS is superior in all but design (it's definitely less elegant). CCS supports higher speeds, liquid cooling, and V2X.
Like others have said, it'll be interesting to see what happens in the industry but for now my money is on CCS.
Being able to take power from a vehicle is a very important feature that should not be overlooked. CCS supports that today, Tesla connector does not. Sure maybe in the future the Tesla design could support it but currently CCS is superior in all but design (it's definitely less elegant). CCS supports higher speeds, liquid cooling, and V2X.
Like others have said, it'll be interesting to see what happens in the industry but for now my money is on CCS.
Could we get the smart phone companies to join into this conversation as well. Every time I turn around it is a newer charging cord connection.
.....thank god wireless phone charging is helping to minimize the cords in the junk drawer at least.
I have had both. I think the Tesla charger is a simpler, tougher and superior design. That said, I don’t see standardization coming anytime soon. I have Tesla wall chargers as I think they are good. But, I don’t have a Tesla car anymore. My wife and I both have BMWs that use the CCS J1772 style. We just use adapters made by Lectron. That’s an accessory that should come with the Scout.
I know a lot of comments have been made to have a charge port on the front and rear of the Scout. Any thought of one of each if there were two? When towing that might require the adapter if you find the opposite charger at a service center but that might be something to consider ???
Adopting the tesla connector is a very bad idea. Even if the connector is "open", it is meaningless unless the entire tech stack is also open. Otherwise you are getting locked into telsa and their whims. This is a common play in the tech industry, as is later coming out with an updated version of the "open" interface that is now "closed" and requires licensing or worse. Even if the CCS connector is worse, anyone can decide to build new charging stations and provide service. Plus tesla themselves are in the process of converting their stations to work with either connector, so everyone will soon have access to their network.
The front is probably the best location especially when it comes to towing. With a plug in the back you have to back into a spot which can be difficult or impossible when a trailer or even bikes are hooked up to the back. A front plug is great to just pull directly into the spot and charge dispute whatever accessory you have attached to the back
The plug should be at the front. Period. On our 4xe we have it by the A pillar on the driver's side, and even then it can be a pain in the dick.
Perfect spot would be front center of ‘grill’ to access from either side.
I’ve got electric panel in basement at front right corner of my garage so selfishly I’d like it on the front passenger quarter panel
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