Offer it with a gas motor

[Schooley]

This should be offered with a gas or diesel engine.
By going strictly EV, you have taken the heart and soul out of the Scout. It wasn’t ever a poser vehicle, it was an almost indestructible work horse. It wasn’t built for luxury, the Scout was a beast.
By offering it only as an EV, you will attract only flannel wearing bun hair hipsters. No self respecting fan of the original Scouts would own one. We all saw them discontinued once and I fear we will see it again.
I would buy one in a gas powered model but will never own an EV. I am a fireman and know the true hazards of EV vehicles that the public is unaware of. EV manufacturers should be required by law to post warnings of hazards in their ads.
I live in a small town in west Texas and have already responded to 2 EV fires. The first was an accident where the battery system failed. The lithium batteries ignited shortly after the crash burning 3 inside. It burned for 12 hours and took 10,000 gallons of water to extinguish. The second caught fire while being rapid charged at an in home charging system. The heat of the charging in a garage compromised the battery housing resulting in a total loss of the vehicle as well as the entire house. I am uncertain of the water usage in this instance. Three department work tirelessly for 14 hours and likely used over 30,000 gallons on this fire. Both regurgitated 10-14 hours of toxic gas into the atmosphere. Water is a precious commodity in west Texas and in many areas across the US is a resource that should never be wasted.

In closing, until there is a better containment system and safer charging options, I feel most EV companies will fail before the technology catches up. Don’t put all your eggs in one basket.

 

[J Alynn]

This should be offered with a gas or diesel engine.
By going strictly EV, you have taken the heart and soul out of the Scout. It wasn’t ever a poser vehicle, it was an almost indestructible work horse. It wasn’t built for luxury, the Scout was a beast.
By offering it only as an EV, you will attract only flannel wearing bun hair hipsters. No self respecting fan of the original Scouts would own one. We all saw them discontinued once and I fear we will see it again.
I would buy one in a gas powered model but will never own an EV. I am a fireman and know the true hazards of EV vehicles that the public is unaware of. EV manufacturers should be required by law to post warnings of hazards in their ads.
I live in a small town in west Texas and have already responded to 2 EV fires. The first was an accident where the battery system failed. The lithium batteries ignited shortly after the crash burning 3 inside. It burned for 12 hours and took 10,000 gallons of water to extinguish. The second caught fire while being rapid charged at an in home charging system. The heat of the charging in a garage compromised the battery housing resulting in a total loss of the vehicle as well as the entire house. I am uncertain of the water usage in this instance. Three department work tirelessly for 14 hours and likely used over 30,000 gallons on this fire. Both regurgitated 10-14 hours of toxic gas into the atmosphere. Water is a precious commodity in west Texas and in many areas across the US is a resource that should never be wasted.

In closing, until there is a better containment system and safer charging options, I feel most EV companies will fail before the technology catches up. Don’t put all your eggs in one basket.

No sense trolling then. Will be no ICE. It’s been beat to death for nearly 2 years.

 

[Harris005]

This should be offered with a gas or diesel engine.
By going strictly EV, you have taken the heart and soul out of the Scout. It wasn’t ever a poser vehicle, it was an almost indestructible work horse. It wasn’t built for luxury, the Scout was a beast.
By offering it only as an EV, you will attract only flannel wearing bun hair hipsters. No self respecting fan of the original Scouts would own one. We all saw them discontinued once and I fear we will see it again.
I would buy one in a gas powered model but will never own an EV. I am a fireman and know the true hazards of EV vehicles that the public is unaware of. EV manufacturers should be required by law to post warnings of hazards in their ads.
I live in a small town in west Texas and have already responded to 2 EV fires. The first was an accident where the battery system failed. The lithium batteries ignited shortly after the crash burning 3 inside. It burned for 12 hours and took 10,000 gallons of water to extinguish. The second caught fire while being rapid charged at an in home charging system. The heat of the charging in a garage compromised the battery housing resulting in a total loss of the vehicle as well as the entire house. I am uncertain of the water usage in this instance. Three department work tirelessly for 14 hours and likely used over 30,000 gallons on this fire. Both regurgitated 10-14 hours of toxic gas into the atmosphere. Water is a precious commodity in west Texas and in many areas across the US is a resource that should never be wasted.

In closing, until there is a better containment system and safer charging options, I feel most EV companies will fail before the technology catches up. Don’t put all your eggs in one basket.

I'm not looking to create another back and forth on this topic, but do want to mention of few things as a self respecting, non bun hair, non hipster (gotta admit I do like my flannels this time of year though ) Scout II owner/enthusiast:

• I enjoy the hell out of my old Scout and am not looking to replace it. I would add that the Scouts of old are STILL beast, fun to work on, fun to hop in and drive with the top down, fun to see the kids grow up enjoying them as well. The classics stay classic and will never be replaced. Enjoy them for what they are! However, for the longest time I have wanted a modern take on that classic Scout, meaning modern tech, modern materials, and modern engineering. You may not want to admit it but Scout Motors checked the box for each of those. Change can be a tough pill to swallow. I too was hesitant on the EV approach, but have come around to being excited to try something new for my everyday driver. I do think its ok to drive a modern Scout with a smile on my face, and hit the trails on the weekend in my Scout II with that same smile. Best of both worlds!
• Respect and thank you for your time as a fireman. My father was a fire chief in a small Kansas town for years.
  • Anything catastrophic from a fire is terrible, no matter what the fuel source is! I hear you on the toxic gases and number of hours to extinguish an EV fire. I agree fire stations of the future should have better ways to extinguish a fire such as this.
  • This topic seems to come up often with the haters. It did get me thinking of all the black spots from car fires I've seen on the side of highways through the years (before EV's). Gas has a sole purpose - to ignite and burn. ICE car fire accidents are bound to happen. What does Google have to say about an EV to ICE fire ratio?
  • Again, not taking away from the fact that in the rare account of an EV fire, the fire itself is more intense; however, the safety ratio leans in favor of an EV.

Did I change your perception of an EV? Likely not
Did I change your stance on fire concerns? Likely not
Did I change you resistance of change? Likely not, but hopeful moving forward you can at least see that others may embrace it and shouldn't be looked down upon for doing so. You may not like modern day tech, and that's totally fine. At least try to be accepting of those that do. None of us can control the fact that time moves on.

Think I'm going to go throw my flannel shirt on, top of the gas and hop in the old Scout.......damnit, forgot I still need to turn some wrenches before the old girl can get back on the road. If only I could hop into my new Terra to head to town for parts

 

[Schooley]

I do like flannel too. Everyone understand I am not against EV’s, I just don’t think the technology is there to make them practical.
I grew up in central Texas on a farm and ranch. At 7 years old, I learned to drive a 1974 Scout II. I was impressed with the thought process of IH in the fact that most was all interchangeable from year to year to year. They were simple but effective.
I just wish they made this in a modern version with a gas engine. That would be my choice for a daily driver. I currently own the original ‘74, a ‘77, and an 80 and love them all. Would just like to add the new one to my collection but a gas engine.
Not trolling

 

[LastDayScout]

I do like flannel too. Everyone understand I am not against EV’s, I just don’t think the technology is there to make them practical.
I grew up in central Texas on a farm and ranch. At 7 years old, I learned to drive a 1974 Scout II. I was impressed with the thought process of IH in the fact that most was all interchangeable from year to year to year. They were simple but effective.
I just wish they made this in a modern version with a gas engine. That would be my choice for a daily driver. I currently own the original ‘74, a ‘77, and an 80 and love them all. Would just like to add the new one to my collection but a gas engine.
Not trolling

I can only suggest that you take a look at the Harvester option. It certainly makes sense for some use cases. You basically get the same technology as locomotives.

 

[R1TVT]

You're trolling when you come in hot talking about an EV fire VS every fire that has ever happened with gas. That is the definition of trolling. let alone assuming that everyone else here is a bun-wearing hipster. Take a breath and start over and use some brain power before assuming that everyone is the same. That is not the case, and does nothing to bolster any argument you have for ICE vs EV. Not to mention the Harvester option announced by Scout.

 

[J Alynn]

I do like flannel too. Everyone understand I am not against EV’s, I just don’t think the technology is there to make them practical.
I grew up in central Texas on a farm and ranch. At 7 years old, I learned to drive a 1974 Scout II. I was impressed with the thought process of IH in the fact that most was all interchangeable from year to year to year. They were simple but effective.
I just wish they made this in a modern version with a gas engine. That would be my choice for a daily driver. I currently own the original ‘74, a ‘77, and an 80 and love them all. Would just like to add the new one to my collection but a gas engine.
Not trolling

You can buy one and shove a small 4 cylinder in the trunk. If it was me didn’t mean to snap but the nearly past two years, after announcing EV was constant people asking for ICE so for some of us on here your post activated our PTSD

 

[Harris005]

I do like flannel too. Everyone understand I am not against EV’s, I just don’t think the technology is there to make them practical.
I grew up in central Texas on a farm and ranch. At 7 years old, I learned to drive a 1974 Scout II. I was impressed with the thought process of IH in the fact that most was all interchangeable from year to year to year. They were simple but effective.
I just wish they made this in a modern version with a gas engine. That would be my choice for a daily driver. I currently own the original ‘74, a ‘77, and an 80 and love them all. Would just like to add the new one to my collection but a gas engine.
Not trolling

I hear ya, and respect your stance. It's a common take. I would challenge you to seek out the Scout Motor tour when it comes around area. See it in person to give it a chance. You might just 'change' your mind.

 

[Scoutsie]

I do like flannel too. Everyone understand I am not against EV’s, I just don’t think the technology is there to make them practical.
I grew up in central Texas on a farm and ranch. At 7 years old, I learned to drive a 1974 Scout II. I was impressed with the thought process of IH in the fact that most was all interchangeable from year to year to year. They were simple but effective.
I just wish they made this in a modern version with a gas engine. That would be my choice for a daily driver. I currently own the original ‘74, a ‘77, and an 80 and love them all. Would just like to add the new one to my collection but a gas engine.
Not trolling

Fair enough. Appreciate this clarification. My parents had a 1975 Scout II and it was a member of our family. I grew up in the city (Boston, MA), but we took a lot of trips outside of the city.

I have a hybrid car now and something that I love about it is how little I have to fill it up and how little I pay when I do. It’s an 9-gallon tank and right now, I think it’s around $25-$30 for a fill up or thereabouts. I’m imagining a gas-powered Scout Motors Traveler/Terra would have a pretty enormous tank to support whatever ludicrous engine they end up with (because nobody would suffer a straight 4 on these) and would cost like $80/week at least. I can’t imagine that it would be fuel efficient in any conceivable way.

Are… are you very wealthy? That’s a lot to drop on gas. Maybe I actually want to get with you…

 

[hammick]

This should be offered with a gas or diesel engine.
By going strictly EV, you have taken the heart and soul out of the Scout. It wasn’t ever a poser vehicle, it was an almost indestructible work horse. It wasn’t built for luxury, the Scout was a beast.
By offering it only as an EV, you will attract only flannel wearing bun hair hipsters. No self respecting fan of the original Scouts would own one. We all saw them discontinued once and I fear we will see it again.
I would buy one in a gas powered model but will never own an EV. I am a fireman and know the true hazards of EV vehicles that the public is unaware of. EV manufacturers should be required by law to post warnings of hazards in their ads.
I live in a small town in west Texas and have already responded to 2 EV fires. The first was an accident where the battery system failed. The lithium batteries ignited shortly after the crash burning 3 inside. It burned for 12 hours and took 10,000 gallons of water to extinguish. The second caught fire while being rapid charged at an in home charging system. The heat of the charging in a garage compromised the battery housing resulting in a total loss of the vehicle as well as the entire house. I am uncertain of the water usage in this instance. Three department work tirelessly for 14 hours and likely used over 30,000 gallons on this fire. Both regurgitated 10-14 hours of toxic gas into the atmosphere. Water is a precious commodity in west Texas and in many areas across the US is a resource that should never be wasted.

In closing, until there is a better containment system and safer charging options, I feel most EV companies will fail before the technology catches up. Don’t put all your eggs in one basket.

Not sure why you are here since both models are electric (even with the range extender options). I think you would be better off on the lifted truck forums.

 

[OIBScout]

As with our (not on fire) Tesla, I’ll point to the 175,000 gas and diesel fires on USA roads every year, and the < 250 Tesla fires EVER as I think about my car charging Level 2 in the garage below.

 

[Rampy]

As with our (not on fire) Tesla, I’ll point to the 175,000 gas and diesel fires on USA roads every year, and the < 250 Tesla fires EVER as I think about my car charging Level 2 in the garage below.

Ummmmmmmm, EV’s have benefits but they also have drawbacks and while they don’t burn up as frequently, when they do catch fire it takes way more water to extinguish. Saw a report and cider after one of these recent hurricanes where salt water caused EV’s to burst into flames

What happens when the grid goes down (as we see quite frequently) & you can’t charge? To my way of thinking this is a real benefit of the Harvester system while its wimpy battery is a huge downfall. But as long as you have gasoline available, you can still generate electricity or so the theory goes

EV’s are also way heavier and use up tires faster & that increases environmental contamination up to 400 times more than gasoline/diesel vehicles according to some recent studies

Then you have the controversy over the batteries as far as mining/refining & how it actually uses more energy to build a EV than an equivalent gasser. I don’t know enough yet about the batteries to have an informed opinion

If Ford came out with a EV F350 with the Harvester system, I’d be drooling all over it.

Every vehicle has its pros & cons and the more we learn the better EV’s will get

 

[Scoutsie]

Ummmmmmmm, EV’s have benefits but they also have drawbacks and while they don’t burn up as frequently, when they do catch fire it takes way more water to extinguish. Saw a report and cider after one of these recent hurricanes where salt water caused EV’s to burst into flames

What happens when the grid goes down (as we see quite frequently) & you can’t charge? To my way of thinking this is a real benefit of the Harvester system while its wimpy battery is a huge downfall. But as long as you have gasoline available, you can still generate electricity or so the theory goes

EV’s are also way heavier and use up tires faster & that increases environmental contamination up to 400 times more than gasoline/diesel vehicles according to some recent studies

Then you have the controversy over the batteries as far as mining/refining & how it actually uses more energy to build a EV than an equivalent gasser. I don’t know enough yet about the batteries to have an informed opinion

If Ford came out with a EV F350 with the Harvester system, I’d be drooling all over it.

Every vehicle has its pros & cons and the more we learn the better EV’s will get

Outside of what I’ve seen in Mad Max, which is a work of fiction, I’m still waiting to hear a compelling reason backed by science and economics why gas engines are a better idea than electric engines on cars.

This text is from an article in the New York Times, 10/9/24, Can your electric vehicle catch fire during a hurricane? (pay wall coming):

Electric vehicles contain lithium-ion batteries, which can also be found in e-bikes and scooters, wheelchairs, golf carts, electric lawn mowers and tools like cordless drills. If these batteries are soaked in saltwater, some can ignite after floodwaters subside.

It’s a relatively rare problem, but the risk is real.

Of the 48 lithium-ion battery fires attributed to Hurricane Helene, 11 were caused by electric vehicles, said State Fire Marshal Jimmy Patronis. The rest were electric wheelchairs, hoverboards, scooters and golf carts. The E.V.s that caught fire were a tiny fraction of the more than 254,000 electric vehicles that were registered in Florida at the end of 2023.

So there is that. It doesn’t sound like it’s a widespread risk. It’s less dangerous than going to outer space.

 

[Rampy]

Outside of what I’ve seen in Mad Max, which is a work of fiction, I’m still waiting to hear a compelling reason backed by science and economics why gas engines are a better idea than electric engines on cars.

This text is from an article in the New York Times, 10/9/24, Can your electric vehicle catch fire during a hurricane? (pay wall coming):

So there is that. It doesn’t sound like it’s a widespread risk. It’s less dangerous than going to outer space.

Guess I need to watch Mad Max, nothing I say will ever convince you to even think critically about the benefits of gas/diesel along with the negative’s of EV’s

You would not even believe a video of a EV inside a flooded garage catching fire if you saw it

 

[J Alynn]

Guess I need to watch Mad Max, nothing I say will ever convince you to even think critically about the benefits of gas/diesel along with the negative’s of EV’s

You would not even believe a video of a EV inside a flooded garage catching fire if you saw it

I can’t speak for @Scoutsie but I think there’s a frustration for forum members when new folks join and/or make first post telling SM they need an ICE option. There’s been 23-1/2 months of conversations, debates and down right aggressive comments toward SM needing to have ICE. Scott Keogh has said time and time again SM will build EV’s. And yet after nearly 2 years a small percentage of people still think they should get their Scout with the power plant they choose.
I’ve stated many times since starting here shortly after launch. I was down right pissed initially that the new Scouts are EV but with an open mind I read and learned as well as buying a hybrid as a transition.
As Jamie always says-majority of people aren’t running back to buy corded drills. I’ll add gas powered leaf blowers,etc….
There certainly are circumstances where an EV just might not be right, and so it goes.
That said, people driving their cyber trucks into the oceans aren’t very intelligent. Those refusing to evacuate in a hurricane bring their own misfortune. There is a recent article of a Rivian that started right up after Helen so if/when batteries are packaged properly there is less chance of fires.
Point is, the new SM vehicles just might not be right for everyone and as others stated accidents happen with other ICE vehicles that cause fires
Perhaps emergency services should explore a chemical extinguisher system as many new vehicles are EV. Many emergency services now carry Narcam (sp?) for people who OD (whole other topic) but they evolved. Perhaps that needs to happen at the fire/emergency services.
Just another point of view-no rights or wrongs, just different opinions. But when posting on an EV vehicle site one must anticipate these types of responses toward ICE arguments and “requests”. It’s human nature. Just MHO

 

[Rampy]

I can’t speak for @Scoutsie but I think there’s a frustration for forum members when new folks join and/or make first post telling SM they need an ICE option. There’s been 23-1/2 months of conversations, debates and down right aggressive comments toward SM needing to have ICE. Scott Keogh has said time and time again SM will build EV’s. And yet after nearly 2 years a small percentage of people still think they should get their Scout with the power plant they choose.
I’ve stated many times since starting here shortly after launch. I was down right pissed initially that the new Scouts are EV but with an open mind I read and learned as well as buying a hybrid as a transition.
As Jamie always says-majority of people aren’t running back to buy corded drills. I’ll add gas powered leaf blowers,etc….
There certainly are circumstances where an EV just might not be right, and so it goes.
That said, people driving their cyber trucks into the oceans aren’t very intelligent. Those refusing to evacuate in a hurricane bring their own misfortune. There is a recent article of a Rivian that started right up after Helen so if/when batteries are packaged properly there is less chance of fires.
Point is, the new SM vehicles just might not be right for everyone and as others stated accidents happen with other ICE vehicles that cause fires
Perhaps emergency services should explore a chemical extinguisher system as many new vehicles are EV. Many emergency services now carry Narcam (sp?) for people who OD (whole other topic) but they evolved. Perhaps that needs to happen at the fire/emergency services.
Just another point of view-no rights or wrongs, just different opinions. But when posting on an EV vehicle site one must anticipate these types of responses toward ICE arguments and “requests”. It’s human nature. Just MHO

Not once have I ever said anything negative about Scouts decision & I understand it and am stepping out of my comfort zone to embrace what appears to be the best of two worlds for our location & usage

Not everyone lives in high density cities where EV’s shine some people forget the “flyover states” and can not comprehend going 80mph for 5 hours & only passing a few small towns…and that’s on freeways. The federal government wanted to put a EV charging station every 50 miles on I80 & even running diesel generators to power them it was impossible

I’m excited to see how the Traveler Harvester plays out and hopefully it meets our wants & desires

I can’t speak for using EV’s as emergency vehicles in cities vs rural areas. I’ve seen a couple EV fire engines & cop cars in cities but never rural and no EV ambulances

Not going to get into victim shaming for saying people who do not evacuate get what the deserve, look how far western NC is from the coast, some areas still do not have electricity

What’s wrong with driving on a beach, last time we were in Boca Chica on the beach a couple Tesla cyber trucks were also on the beach. As far as water, what about winter when you have feet of snow, busting snowdrift 3-4 feet high, snow gets into everything & melts/freezes

Coming full circle, every vehicle has its strong points and weaknesses and EV’s are very young and growing technology

Here is a link to the Tesla catching fire in a flooded garage.

https://www.nbcmiami.com/news/local...garage-flooded-from-hurricane-helene/3430238/

 

[Scoutsie]

What my homey @J Alynn very patiently and diplomatically stated is true: what you’re reading from me is a lot of frustration. Since the Scout announcement has been drawing closer, more and more people have been showing up and insisting, with varying degrees of stubbornness, that Scout has to provide a gas engine. It is, I daresay, triggering. It is triggering because this has been discussed to death and it’s wearying. For the people who haven’t been here longer, maybe it’s worse. Maybe they’re more patient than me, but it’s frustrating to me that it’s been made incredibly clear that this is what it is. This time and money has been spent on this topic. It’s not changing. That is the reality.

Edit: it was really early in the morning/late at night when I wrote this and got my wires crossed and thought I was responding to OP, who mentioned being a firefighter

That said, what I said wasn’t fair. What you saw is reality. You have to see the aftermath of what happens when people make supply-side decisions like “let’s get toilet-bowl batteries” and the result is people paying with their lives and that’s criminal. Someone should go to jail for that and someone likely won’t. I was on a white-collar crime grand jury a decade-ish ago for where we filed murder charges against the CEO and lackey of a pharmaceuticals company because a product of theirs killed a bunch of people purely to make more money for themselves. I wish the charges had stuck because they were very much cold-blooded murderers. I apologize for not saying that what you had to see and deal with was valid.

I hope you understand that I feel optimistic about electric cars because I think these problems have solutions. There was a guy in the lab I worked at who did a lot of research on graphene and graphene batteries. It’s seen as a good solution for car batteries in a decade. I hope it’ll be safer. People shouldn’t die for trying to do what they believe to be a good thing for the environment or their own economic situation or whatever their motivation is.

 

[Bodie]

I can’t speak for @Scoutsie but I think there’s a frustration for forum members when new folks join and/or make first post telling SM they need an ICE option. There’s been 23-1/2 months of conversations, debates and down right aggressive comments toward SM needing to have ICE. Scott Keogh has said time and time again SM will build EV’s. And yet after nearly 2 years a small percentage of people still think they should get their Scout with the power plant they choose.
I’ve stated many times since starting here shortly after launch. I was down right pissed initially that the new Scouts are EV but with an open mind I read and learned as well as buying a hybrid as a transition.
As Jamie always says-majority of people aren’t running back to buy corded drills. I’ll add gas powered leaf blowers,etc….
There certainly are circumstances where an EV just might not be right, and so it goes.
That said, people driving their cyber trucks into the oceans aren’t very intelligent. Those refusing to evacuate in a hurricane bring their own misfortune. There is a recent article of a Rivian that started right up after Helen so if/when batteries are packaged properly there is less chance of fires.
Point is, the new SM vehicles just might not be right for everyone and as others stated accidents happen with other ICE vehicles that cause fires
Perhaps emergency services should explore a chemical extinguisher system as many new vehicles are EV. Many emergency services now carry Narcam (sp?) for people who OD (whole other topic) but they evolved. Perhaps that needs to happen at the fire/emergency services.
Just another point of view-no rights or wrongs, just different opinions. But when posting on an EV vehicle site one must anticipate these types of responses toward ICE arguments and “requests”. It’s human nature. Just MHO

I totally get the frustration with the tone of many of the "I want ICE" posts but, to be fair, it seems likely that the past 23 1/2 months of folks wanting ICE at least partly drove the decision to offer the Harvester option (which is exactly what I would want). SM seems to be a company that listens to what the people want, which is smart, because people have the money that companies want to get. Obviously, the business case made sense for them to add the Harvester. My guess is because they could do it without designing a whole different architecture. It seems unlikely that they will offer a full ICE vehicle any time soon because that would be on an entirely different platform (maybe an entirely different production line) and they will probably (hopefully) be putting their resources to work on the ones they just revealed. Maybe @Jamie@ScoutMotors could make a sticky post at the top as an ICE FAQ that ICE posters can be referred to (civilly ).

 

[Jamie@ScoutMotors]

I appreciate the civil discourse on this topic as it is refreshing to see.

My personal hope is that we can support each other in learning more about this significant transition in the automotive world. Change never comes easy, and I've often told people that the supportive discussions in this community are exactly what we hope for among Scout owners. We will have a lot to talk about on Scout's road to production, and hopefully, we all learn a little something along the way.

Jamie

 

[ChasingCoral]

By offering it only as an EV, you will attract only flannel wearing bun hair hipsters. No self respecting fan of the original Scouts would own one. We all saw them discontinued once and I fear we will see it again.

I'm no bun hair hipster and the first vehicle I owned was a '71 Scout II. I love what Scout Motors has done here. If you want gas, get the version with the Harvester EREV. If you want gas or diesel, you are out of luck.