Lessons Learned on Range Anxiety

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Harris005

Scout Community Veteran
1st Year Member
Nov 15, 2022
478
1,052
Oak Grove, MO.
The wife and I recently flew out to Denver for a long weekend get away (Whiskey Myers concert at Red Rock - highly recommend!). We rented our car through National, which allows you to pick any car in certain rows. As we approached this area to select one, we came across two EV options. I wanted to take the opportunity to try one out for the weekend; however, I couldn't work up the courage to do so knowing we would be doing a lot of driving in the mountains. .....that dang ol' range anxiety won again 😞

As we were about to get into our comfort zone ICE rental, a Grand Cherokee Hybrid pulled up. Range anxiety gone, jumped in and headed to the mountains.

Day 1 - Disappointed! I watched the digital gauge continue to show >1% on the battery. I figured the ICE side of things would charge as we go....I was wrong. Really had no interaction with the battery side at all and was contemplating finding a charger to at least try the battery side out.

Day 2 - No driving, visiting family

Day 3 - Dumbass mode disengaged! If found a button (late in the day on our way to Breckenridge). Clicked that button with a battery icon and some circular arrows. Immediately noticed when I let off the gas the SUV was slowing down much faster. Seems that the regenerative braking you all talk about on this forum is activated by a button. Who knew....I sure didn't. So now we are seeing that battery percentage on the rise.

Day 4 - Lets experiment on our way back to the Denver airport. We decided to take the longer, more scenic route via Loveland Pass. Between the climb up and the downward slopes in-between the climb, I had found myself with a whopping 12% of battery as we reached the top of Loveland Pass. I had also looked down to see that my gas range showed to be 335 miles left on that tank. On the descent I found myself constantly watching the battery vs gas engine usage. I was able to finesse the throttle, without changing the speed much, and actually charge the battery instead of use the battery. The ICE indicator was almost non-existent. SO, how far could I go, IN THE MOUNTAINS (mind you it was not all descents), before running out of my 12% of battery and having to switch back to ICE? 40 miles!!! That 12% battery charge seemed to last forever! Yes, I know, your thinking "but it was all down hill". It really wasn't though. Again, I was constantly watching that battery gauge and finding it would use up some battery, then charge, then use, then...well you get the point. All in all it was kinda fun to see just how well it did in the mountains contrary to my initial expectation when choosing not to pick the EV. All those Tesla's I saw in the mountains continued to rub that in. I continued to watch the gauges as I drove through Denver and on to the airport. The recharge rate was not as good, but still there. The only reason I bring that up is because throughout that trip from the top of Loveland Pass to the airport (80+ miles total), my gas range was 332 miles from the starting point of 335 miles 🤯.

Lesson Learned? Re-gen in the mountains was impressive, and next time I'm planning not to scare off so easy and regain some sense of adventure in life! Those Rocky Mountains are where I fell in love with my cousin's Scout II 30 years ago, and now I can't wait to try out a 2026 on our next trip to Breckenridge 🍻
 
Latest warning on pure EVs is know ahead of time where the manual door release is hidden in case the separate 12v battery dies and locks you inside
The thing is, the door release mechanism, or the door handle design has absolutely nothing with the drive system being electric or ice. It’s purely a matter of design choices and fashion. Same goes for touch screens, capacitive buttons, minimalist design, spare tires, one pedal driving, steering by wire, braking by wire, &c, &c. Unfortunately many (most?) car companies are just imitating Tesla w.r.t. to many of these decisions.

This gives Scout many opportunities to differentiate itself.
 
Latest warning on pure EVs is know ahead of time where the manual door release is hidden in case the separate 12v battery dies and locks you inside
That's pretty much exclusively a Tesla thing and their design choices. It has nothing to do with a vehicle being a pure EV or not. It's not a problem on my Hyundai EV and it wasn't a problem on my last EV. It's only a problem for Tesla because they chose to use an electronic button to open the doors instead of a conventional latch like a normal car. I doubt Scout would make the same design choices as Tesla on such basic things. Tesla tends to "innovate" even when existing solutions work fine and are objectively better in many cases.
 
The wife and I recently flew out to Denver for a long weekend get away (Whiskey Myers concert at Red Rock - highly recommend!). We rented our car through National, which allows you to pick any car in certain rows. As we approached this area to select one, we came across two EV options. I wanted to take the opportunity to try one out for the weekend; however, I couldn't work up the courage to do so knowing we would be doing a lot of driving in the mountains. .....that dang ol' range anxiety won again 😞

As we were about to get into our comfort zone ICE rental, a Grand Cherokee Hybrid pulled up. Range anxiety gone, jumped in and headed to the mountains.

Day 1 - Disappointed! I watched the digital gauge continue to show >1% on the battery. I figured the ICE side of things would charge as we go....I was wrong. Really had no interaction with the battery side at all and was contemplating finding a charger to at least try the battery side out.

Day 2 - No driving, visiting family

Day 3 - Dumbass mode disengaged! If found a button (late in the day on our way to Breckenridge). Clicked that button with a battery icon and some circular arrows. Immediately noticed when I let off the gas the SUV was slowing down much faster. Seems that the regenerative braking you all talk about on this forum is activated by a button. Who knew....I sure didn't. So now we are seeing that battery percentage on the rise.

Day 4 - Lets experiment on our way back to the Denver airport. We decided to take the longer, more scenic route via Loveland Pass. Between the climb up and the downward slopes in-between the climb, I had found myself with a whopping 12% of battery as we reached the top of Loveland Pass. I had also looked down to see that my gas range showed to be 335 miles left on that tank. On the descent I found myself constantly watching the battery vs gas engine usage. I was able to finesse the throttle, without changing the speed much, and actually charge the battery instead of use the battery. The ICE indicator was almost non-existent. SO, how far could I go, IN THE MOUNTAINS (mind you it was not all descents), before running out of my 12% of battery and having to switch back to ICE? 40 miles!!! That 12% battery charge seemed to last forever! Yes, I know, your thinking "but it was all down hill". It really wasn't though. Again, I was constantly watching that battery gauge and finding it would use up some battery, then charge, then use, then...well you get the point. All in all it was kinda fun to see just how well it did in the mountains contrary to my initial expectation when choosing not to pick the EV. All those Tesla's I saw in the mountains continued to rub that in. I continued to watch the gauges as I drove through Denver and on to the airport. The recharge rate was not as good, but still there. The only reason I bring that up is because throughout that trip from the top of Loveland Pass to the airport (80+ miles total), my gas range was 332 miles from the starting point of 335 miles 🤯.

Lesson Learned? Re-gen in the mountains was impressive, and next time I'm planning not to scare off so easy and regain some sense of adventure in life! Those Rocky Mountains are where I fell in love with my cousin's Scout II 30 years ago, and now I can't wait to try out a 2026 on our next trip to Breckenridge 🍻
Sorry to hear you chickened out on the EV but glad to hear you had a fun experience with the hybrid. Now you should feel a bit more confident next time if there's an EV option. It is a bit of a different experience than a combustion car. It's not harder or more confusing or anything, just different so it needs you to adjust to a new way of doing things than what most drivers are used to. You'd want to see if the places you stay have charging available or nearby. You'd want to get familiar with some of the fast chargers where you're going and how they work, that sort of thing. It's not hard and there are plenty of EV drivers that would be more than happy to help you learn the ropes. You might even want to just go to your local fast charger and hang out for a bit talking to EV owners just to get an idea of how it all works.

Plug-in hybrids are a good gateway to EV but nothing beats ditching combustion engines and fuel altogether!
 
Sorry to hear you chickened out on the EV but glad to hear you had a fun experience with the hybrid. Now you should feel a bit more confident next time if there's an EV option. It is a bit of a different experience than a combustion car. It's not harder or more confusing or anything, just different so it needs you to adjust to a new way of doing things than what most drivers are used to. You'd want to see if the places you stay have charging available or nearby. You'd want to get familiar with some of the fast chargers where you're going and how they work, that sort of thing. It's not hard and there are plenty of EV drivers that would be more than happy to help you learn the ropes. You might even want to just go to your local fast charger and hang out for a bit talking to EV owners just to get an idea of how it all works.

Plug-in hybrids are a good gateway to EV but nothing beats ditching combustion engines and fuel altogether!
I hate that I did chicken out looking back. If it was anything but the mountains I would have been all in for the chance to give it a try. Next time EV for sure!
 
On long trips, until the nations charging station situations become more available and reliable, we'll have a tow hitch on the back of the Scout and mounted on it will be a small 240V INVERTER generator covered. Looks like a red neck Hybrid situation,, because it is. Hey, this is the USA. Peace of mind.


Inverter and 240V essential.
 
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Here are a few things that have helped with my R1T ownership experience and charging...

First, the opening of dedicated Rivian RAN charging sites in my state and surrounding states along a couple of major Highways (I-95, I-90, and I-89 to be specific)...

Second, the recent arrival of my NACS adapter from Rivian to use at Tesla SuperCharger sites (have not had the need to do this yet, but great that it has arrived!).

Third, the purchase of a TESLA adapter (TESLA TAP MINI is a commonly used adpter) for L2 Tesla destination chargers (common at hotels) and often free to charge.

Feels like charging has never been easier, but I also have a charger installed at home, so I am always starting a longer trip topped-off, or at least at a 50-70% SOC most of the time... Great to also have just under ~300 miles of full range at 100% SOC on 20" wheels and A/T tires.
 
My lifted Toyota 4Runner with AT tires only got 283 miles to a tank (13.5mpg average). I might have gotten down to "E" a couple of times but never ran out of gas on a trip or had a concern regarding range.
The first week with my BEV Rivian R1S, all I did was watch the battery gage and how much range I had remaining - even though the Rivian has nearly 40 miles more range than my 4Runner ever did and can plug in at literally ANY outlet if the need should arise. After a week or two as an EV owner, I realized that I typically only drive about 30-60 miles a day and don't use more than 10-20% of my available battery power. I own multiple plug adaptors and should things ever get into the red, it's reassuring that nearly EVERY man-made structure on the planet has an outlet available. After a few months of EV ownership, you wonder how people driving ICE vehicles don't have range anxiety since they cannot fill their tanks at home and rely on specialized businesses to be open and available 24-7, should they need a refill. Range anxiety is real, but it goes away after you've owned an EV for a week or two.

Visiting a gas station and dropping $40-60 was something I used to do nearly every 7-10 days with my 4Runner. I've only been to a gas station once since picking up my EV 3 months ago, to get slushies with the kids. I'm not sure how most of those businesses will survive. It would be interesting to see some Gas Station data from countries like Norway, where over 80% of new car purchases are now EVs. I'd imagine that in 10-20 years, classic Scout owners will be the ones using apps and technology to locate businesses that still sell gasoline and to review trip routes in advance to avoid getting stranded.
 
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My lifted Toyota 4Runner with AT tires only got 283 miles to a tank (13.5mpg average). I might have gotten down to "E" a couple of times but never ran out of gas on a trip or had a concern regarding range.
The first week with my BEV Rivian R1S, all I did was watch the battery gage and how much range I had remaining - even though the Rivian has nearly 40 miles more range than my 4Runner ever did and can plug in at literally ANY outlet if the need should arise. After a week or two as an EV owner, I realized that I typically only drive about 30-60 miles a day and don't use more than 10-20% of my available battery power. I own multiple plug adaptors and should things ever get into the red, it's reassuring that nearly EVERY man-made structure on the planet has an outlet available. After a few months of EV ownership, you wonder how people driving ICE vehicles don't have range anxiety since they cannot fill their tanks at home and rely on specialized businesses to be open and available 24-7, should they need a refill. Range anxiety is real, but it goes away after you've owned an EV for a week or two.

Visiting a gas station and dropping $40-60 was something I used to do nearly every 7-10 days with my 4Runner. I've only been to a gas station once since picking up my EV 3 months ago, to get slushies with the kids. I'm not sure how most of those businesses will survive. It would be interesting to see some Gas Station data from countries like Norway, where over 80% of new car purchases are now EVs. I'd imagine that in 10-20 years, classic Scout owners will be the ones using apps and technology to locate businesses that still sell gasoline and to review trip routes in advance to avoid getting stranded.
This is a great post and well thought out on your end. We need more folks like you beating the drums (is that PC?) in favor of EV’s.
It comes down to education-both science and real world driver experience and a willingness to be open to learning. I have a 23-ish? Year old intern that’s been sitting next to me all summer. He’s a car guy-drives a 10 year old Volvo s60. I find pleasure if bantering with him as his responses all lack education.
“CVT engines suck”
“Range anxiety”- limited use off-road
“Expensive to charge EV’s at super-chargers”
“They’re really not environmentally friendly” -coal, batteries-yada yada yada as I chuckle out loud
And the list goes on and as soon as I get bored taunting him I shut him down and ask if his opinion is developed by education/science or hearsay and that generally shuts him up.
I’ve been on this forum since nearly day one and I’m old enough to admit that I’m not always right. Many know I’m a Scout fan-not an EV fan but nearly 2 years on this forum has provided me with a wealth of knowledge and acceptance that EV’s definitely have a great place in the automotive world and I’m anxious to get on board when the Scout hits the market.
BTW-what are EV owners spending when they charge during a road trip? And at home if you are tracking it?
Also been wondering what people have spent installing chargers at home, I’m sure it varies and I’ve researched it but curious to hear first hand
 
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...the list goes on and as soon as I get bored taunting him I shut him down and ask if his opinion is developed by education/science or hearsay and that generally shuts him up.
Lol @J Alynn , I have been following EV "news" and forums for years. I was a Tesla fanboy without ever owning one. I can say with confidence that it's all very different when you experience it first hand. I'm surprised by how often I encounter misinformation fueled by soundbites, tweets, "influencers," and just mindless groupthink in general. More frequently than not, I am learning that second-hand news has become the new personal experience.

Just minutes ago when I spoke with the guy who does landscaping/lawncare stuff in our neighborhood, he pointed over to my Rivian and his first words were, "I saw your new car the other week, that's 100% electric, right? I bet that's a real PITA when it storms and the power goes out."
I just shrugged and replied, "Quite the opposite, last time the power went out I used it as a generator to run my fridge and tub freezer. The 135KwH battery in there has the capacity of 10 Tesla Powerwalls. It would cost someone over $100k to install something like that as a home backup power generator, but I just plugged in an extension cord." It derailed him from where he was going, hoping that I was somehow regretting my mistake to go EV. I told him that I had been wanting to go EV for years, but wasn't going to switch until I was confident that my EV could do everything that I needed my ICE car to do. Now I have a 835HP, four motor 3 row SUV that has more range than my last (gas-powered) car and my Rivian lease is actually costing me less per month than my old car note. I didn't want to go down the rabbit hole with the whole bidirectional EV charging thing (that should be coming with the next generation of Rivian chargers), but he got the point.
 
The wife and I recently flew out to Denver for a long weekend get away (Whiskey Myers concert at Red Rock - highly recommend!). We rented our car through National, which allows you to pick any car in certain rows. As we approached this area to select one, we came across two EV options. I wanted to take the opportunity to try one out for the weekend; however, I couldn't work up the courage to do so knowing we would be doing a lot of driving in the mountains. .....that dang ol' range anxiety won again 😞

As we were about to get into our comfort zone ICE rental, a Grand Cherokee Hybrid pulled up. Range anxiety gone, jumped in and headed to the mountains.

Day 1 - Disappointed! I watched the digital gauge continue to show >1% on the battery. I figured the ICE side of things would charge as we go....I was wrong. Really had no interaction with the battery side at all and was contemplating finding a charger to at least try the battery side out.

Day 2 - No driving, visiting family

Day 3 - Dumbass mode disengaged! If found a button (late in the day on our way to Breckenridge). Clicked that button with a battery icon and some circular arrows. Immediately noticed when I let off the gas the SUV was slowing down much faster. Seems that the regenerative braking you all talk about on this forum is activated by a button. Who knew....I sure didn't. So now we are seeing that battery percentage on the rise.

Day 4 - Lets experiment on our way back to the Denver airport. We decided to take the longer, more scenic route via Loveland Pass. Between the climb up and the downward slopes in-between the climb, I had found myself with a whopping 12% of battery as we reached the top of Loveland Pass. I had also looked down to see that my gas range showed to be 335 miles left on that tank. On the descent I found myself constantly watching the battery vs gas engine usage. I was able to finesse the throttle, without changing the speed much, and actually charge the battery instead of use the battery. The ICE indicator was almost non-existent. SO, how far could I go, IN THE MOUNTAINS (mind you it was not all descents), before running out of my 12% of battery and having to switch back to ICE? 40 miles!!! That 12% battery charge seemed to last forever! Yes, I know, your thinking "but it was all down hill". It really wasn't though. Again, I was constantly watching that battery gauge and finding it would use up some battery, then charge, then use, then...well you get the point. All in all it was kinda fun to see just how well it did in the mountains contrary to my initial expectation when choosing not to pick the EV. All those Tesla's I saw in the mountains continued to rub that in. I continued to watch the gauges as I drove through Denver and on to the airport. The recharge rate was not as good, but still there. The only reason I bring that up is because throughout that trip from the top of Loveland Pass to the airport (80+ miles total), my gas range was 332 miles from the starting point of 335 miles 🤯.

Lesson Learned? Re-gen in the mountains was impressive, and next time I'm planning not to scare off so easy and regain some sense of adventure in life! Those Rocky Mountains are where I fell in love with my cousin's Scout II 30 years ago, and now I can't wait to try out a 2026 on our next trip to Breckenridge 🍻

You lost me at “JEEP”…
 
A hybrid has built in reserve if you don't use up both battery AND fuel. So if one runs out you are not stranded. And out in no man's land west of Steamboat Springs where the cattle do roam free and asking a local if you can find one to ask to plug into their house for a quick topoff will be met with the business end of a rifle having the ability to dump in the couple gallons you carried with you in Jerry cans is your only salvation.

I have run out of gas a couple of times, as did my father before me. Even if hoofing a couple miles is involved a can of gas will get you going again. If one runs an EV to zero there is no juice in a can to get you 15 more miles
 
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You can have "built in reserve" in any configuration, ICE, hybrid or Pure EV... That is not a mutually exclusive option for Hybrid-only. The question to ask yourself is how often do you forget to top off your tank or top off your battery before a road trip into the land of free roaming cattle? Personally, I have never been stranded in ICE or my EV, and have never run all the way out of juice or gas. YMMV.
 
Makes sense. A few years back Mazda was talking up a long range EV with gasoline back up. Of course a compact Wankel motor was mentioned in the same breath.
A hybrid has built in reserve if you don't use up both battery AND fuel. So if one runs out you are not stranded. And out in no man's land west of Steamboat Springs where the cattle do roam free and asking a local if you can find one to ask to plug into their house for a quick topoff will be met with the business end of a rifle having the ability to dump in the couple gallons you carried with you in Jerry cans is your only salvation.

I have run out of gas a couple of times, as did my father before me. Even if hoofing a couple miles is involved a can of gas will get you going again. If one runs an EV to zero there is no juice in a can to get you 15 more miles
Makes sense but some states are passing EV only sales laws to eventually take effect. I think the USA is up to 3 or 4 states now.

Let me add, a bit off subject, I mention this because I'll forget and it may help someone. Never use the wet rag on the charger handle trick. Yeah the charge speeds up because the cool wet rag is cheating and fooling the sensors in the handle that are there to protect the charge process.
tesla-owners-are-putting-wet-towels-on-supercharger-handles-v0-UwT1MCOfx73PzmyITlQlKeymNrba4J1G3NEn09968PM.jpg
 
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I have NEVER seen anyone try or do this while charging.
Appears to be some sort of strange propaganda.
I would imagine that if you do this, you may be up for some sort of Darwin award - that is if it even works to slightly increase rates.

Also, to be clear about EV sales mandates by state:

"ACCII regulations will only prohibit the sale of new internal-combustion passenger vehicles (cars, SUVs and light-duty trucks) starting in 2035. They wouldn’t, however, require drivers of gas cars to forfeit ownership of previous models. Residents of these states could still buy used gas-powered vehicles within the state’s borders. Likewise, nothing in the regulation would prohibit drivers from buying a new gas car from a state without the ban, then registering it within a state that has one. Although amendments can be made at any time, currently only the sale of gas-powered cars by 2035 would be prohibited in a state whose standards are identical to ACCII."

I'm sure most people understand that this will be a very gradual process, and won't overreact to legislation that is in the works and that can change over time, but just my 02 cents!
 
This is a great post and well thought out on your end. We need more folks like you beating the drums (is that PC?) in favor of EV’s.
It comes downwards to education-both science and real world driver experience and a willingness to be open to learning. I have a 23-ish? Year old intern that’s been sitting next to me all summer. He’s a car guy-drives a 10 year old Volvo s60. I find pleasure if bantering with him as his responses all lack education.
“CVT engines suck”
“Range anxiety”- limited use off-road
“Expensive to charge EV’s at super-chargers”
“They’re really not environmentally friendly” -coal, batteries-yada yada yada as I chuckle out loud
And the list goes on and as soon as I get bored taunting him I shut him down and ask if his opinion is developed by education/science or hearsay and that generally shuts him up.
I’ve been on this forum since nearly day one and I’m old enough to admit that I’m not always right. Many know I’m a Scout fan-not an EV fan but nearly 2 years on this forum has provided me with a wealth of knowledge and acceptance that EV’s definitely have a great place in the automotive world and I’m anxious to get on board when the Scout hits the market.
BTW-what are EV owners spending when they charge during a road trip? And at home if you are tracking it?
Also been wondering what people have spent installing chargers at home, I’m sure it varies and I’ve researched it but curious to hear first hand
I just did a seven hour road trip in my EV yesterday. Only needed one charging stop at a fast charger and it cost $20. Normally charging at home costs me under $2 for a ‘full tank’. I typically charge at home about once a week. Needless to say we have never noticed the EV on our hydro bill.
 
I just did a seven hour road trip in my EV yesterday. Only needed one charging stop at a fast charger and it cost $20. Normally charging at home costs me under $2 for a ‘full tank’. I typically charge at home about once a week. Needless to say we have never noticed the EV on our hydro bill.
Assuming that’s Canadian so probably just a bit more from our side of the line. Thanks for sharing this as it helps me understand the costs from that side of things
 
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